Jim Staley--Identity Crisis-- "vs" patrick j miron miss intreperation of scriptureWhy would Jesus say"I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel" in Matthew ?

ok



For two thousand years we have all been taught that Israel is the Jewish people and the Jewish people are Israel. This misunderstanding has crippled our ability to truly glean from the scriptures all that was originally intended. The greatest prophecy of the bible concerns this very topic. Many have called this teaching the key to understanding the entire bible. I will let Professor C.A.L. Totten of Yale University tell you his thoughts concerning this very subject:

"I can never be too thankful to the Almighty that in my youth he used the late Professor Wilson to show me the difference between the two houses. The very understanding of this difference is the KEY by which almost the entire Bible becomes intelligible, and I cannot state too strongly that the man who has not yet seen that Israel of the Scripture is totally distinct from the Jewish people, is yet in the very infancy, the mere alphabet of Biblical study, and that to this day the meaning of seven-eighths of the Bible is shut to his understanding."

Thread Tools

Search Thread

Display

#16   May 26, '10, 4:24 pm

John7 Regular Member   Join Date: December 22, 2008 Posts: 1,290 Religion: Catholic

Re: Why would Jesus say"I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel" in Matthew ? Quote: Originally Posted by Tamsulosin Furthermore why would Jesus,everybody's merciful Lord, say that" he was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel", according to Matthew? I do not understand this. Tam When I read Matt 15.24 I try to remember this verse: John 10:16 And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd. __________________ I can smell the foul stench of satan

#17   May 26, '10, 4:57 pm

PJM Senior Member   Join Date: August 31, 2008 Posts: 8,516 Religion: Informed, practicing RomanCatholic

Re: Why would Jesus say"I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel" in Matthew ? Quote: =Tamsulosin [1] According to this scripture a Canaanite woman was asking Jesus to have mercy and help her daughter possessed by a demon.Why would Jesus not answer ,[2] and why would the disciples begged him to send her away? [3] Furthermore why would Jesus,everybody's merciful Lord, say that" he was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel", according to Matthew? I do not understand this. Tam Hi Tam allow me to explain. [1] One must understand that in the OT the ONLY people to be "saved" were the Jewish nation; "The so called 'Chosen People' ' It is from this position by God [Yahweh] that Jesus launches His Mission at a Jewish Wedding Feast in Canna. The entended to be saved are at this point th Jews; but because of rejection and persecutuon of Christ; He slowly expands this [with reluctence]to all. MATT. 28: 19-20 " "Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, to the close of the age." It soon becomes evident that [Luke 19: 41-44 Jesus weeps over the hardhearted Jewish Nation and prophises its demise which happens in 71 A.D.] "[41] And when he drew near and saw the city [Jerusalem] he wept over it, "saying, "Would that even today you knew the things that make for peace! But now they are hid from your eyes. For the days shall come upon you, when your enemies will cast up a bank about you and surround you, and hem you in on every side, and dash you to the ground, you and your children within you, and they will not leave one stone upon another in you; because you did not know the time of your visitation." [2] Jesus entends to do as asked but wants to check her faith. Se passes th test and He does the cure. [3] The Apostles [Jews} had not yet understood that salvation was to be for everyone. It would not be until after the Ascension of Jesus that Peter got the message and made it oficial doctrine of the CC. [ACTS c. 11] [4] "The lot sheep of Isreal" From Haydock's Comentary: Our Lord crosses the wishes of the Chanaanæan, not that he intended to reject her, but that he might bring to light the hidden and secret treasure of her virtue. Let us admire not only the greatness of her faith, but likewise the profoundness of her humility; for when our Saviour called the Jews children, so far from being envious of another's praise, she readily answers, and gives them the title of lords; and when Christ likened her to a dog, she presently acknowledges the meanness of her condition. He refused at first to listen to her petition, says the same saint, to instruct us with what faith, humility, and perseverance we ought to pray. To make his servants more sensible of his mercy, and more eager to obtain it, he often appears to pay no attention to their prayers, till he had exercised them in the virtues of humility and patience. Ask, and you shall receive; knock, and it shall be opened to you. Love and prayers, Pat __________________ PJM http://working4christ2.wordpress.com Can we partake of God's GLORY and NOT partake of His PASSION? NO! A.B. Fulton Sheen: "The truth is the truth even if nobody believes it, and a lie is still a lie, even if everybody believes it."

#18   May 26, '10, 5:47 pm

Tamsulosin Regular Member Forum Supporter   Join Date: March 3, 2009 Posts: 552 Religion: Catholic

Re: Why would Jesus say"I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel" in Matthew ? PJM: Am I understanding you correctly that Jesus expanded salvation to all humanity with "reluctancy" because his intention was to only save his people,the ones He chose? If that is true, it will change forever my concept of Jesus.This could be pivotal in my faith, since I was always taught that He cared and loved each of us, and was charitable even to his enemies.Was this a Catholic fairy tale then? I am ready to weep for it is a disappointment. The biggest disappointment of my life. Tam

#19   May 26, '10, 8:31 pm

Nathan Wagar Regular Member   Join Date: March 10, 2009 Posts: 1,014 Religion: Christian, Latin Rite

Re: Why would Jesus say"I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel" in Matthew ? I disagree strongly. The covenant with Abraham was a promise, IN THE OLD TESTAMENT, to bless ALL nations through him. Israel was the name of God's chosen people. The family was always meant to get bigger though. This is why Jesus recapitulated salvation history by going to primarily Israle first, then the gentiles. He set the example for what was to come for his apostles, however, by healing the syro-phoenician woman.

#20   May 27, '10, 8:12 am

PJM Senior Member   Join Date: August 31, 2008 Posts: 8,516 Religion: Informed, practicing RomanCatholic

Re: Why would Jesus say"I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel" in Matthew ? Quote: Tamsulosin;6680502]PJM: Am I understanding you correctly that Jesus expanded salvation to all humanity with "reluctancy" because his intention was to only save his people,the ones He chose? If that is true, it will change forever my concept of Jesus.This could be pivotal in my faith, since I was always taught that He cared and loved each of us, and was charitable even to his enemies.Was this a Catholic fairy tale then? I am ready to weep for it is a disappointment. The biggest disappointment of my life. Tam My oops! Poor choice of words: "disapointment" would have been a better and more accurate term. I'm TRULY sorry! From these verses one can be assurred that God who always is in charge knew from the beggining that salvaion would be available to all; though many would refuse God's conditions. Indeed God by His very Nature : "All and every good thing Perfectd" Gravely obligates Himself to offer at least "sufficient grace" to every human being, to permit them to make the freewill decision to cooperate with God's ungoing plan for humanities salvation. Redemption: Access to heaven is once again accomplishd; PRAISE GOD! But salvation requires cooperation with Gods plan for us. It is a process, that begains and grows from the Faith of "I Believe." Luke 2: 10-14 "And the angel said to them, "Be not afraid; for behold, I bring you good news of a great joy which will come to all the people; for to you is born this day in the city of David a Savior, who is Christ the Lord. And this will be a sign for you: you will find a babe wrapped in swaddling cloths and lying in a manger." And suddenly there was with the angel a multitude of the heavenly host praising God and saying, "Glory to God in the highest, and on earth peace among men with whom he is pleased!" Luke 2: 26-32 26] And it had been revealed to him by the Holy Spirit that he should not see death before he had seen the Lord's Christ. And inspired by the Spirit he came into the temple; and when the parents brought in the child Jesus, to do for him according to the custom of the law, he took him up in his arms and blessed God and said, "Lord, now lettest thou thy servant depart in peace,according to thy word; for mine eyes have seen thy salvation which thou hast prepared in the presence of all peoples, a light for revelation to the Gentiles,and for glory to thy people Israel." Again allow to say how sorry I am for chosing a word, that ought to have better defined the situation. A GREAT MANY of Our Lords miracles took place after "faith" had been established. The very first word from Jesus hanging on the Cross; speaking to those who just put Him there; and to us...."FATHER FORGIVE THEM THEY KNOW NOT WHAT THEY DO! [Luke 23:34] Gods special blessings, Pat __________________ PJM http://working4christ2.wordpress.com Can we partake of God's GLORY and NOT partake of His PASSION? NO! A.B. Fulton Sheen: "The truth is the truth even if nobody believes it, and a lie is still a lie, even if everybody believes it."

#21   May 27, '10, 9:16 am

Tamsulosin Regular Member Forum Supporter   Join Date: March 3, 2009 Posts: 552 Religion: Catholic

Re: Why would Jesus say"I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel" in Matthew ? The Jesus for all humanity is what I have always held to be true, so when I read in the bible words that hint a different concept, or hear from someone knowledgeable speak to the contrary, it tends to shake the whole foundation upon which I chose to lead my life. Thank you all for clarifying as best you could this passage in Matthew. Grateful, Tam

#22   May 27, '10, 1:44 pm

Nita Regular Member Book Club Member   Join Date: October 23, 2006 Posts: 4,335 Religion: Catholic

Re: Why would Jesus say"I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel" in Matthew ? Quote: Originally Posted by PJM [b][i]Hi Tam allow me to explain. [1] One must understand that in the OT the ONLY people to be "saved" were the Jewish nation; "The so called 'Chosen People' ' ... Hi Pat, Imagine it was a lack of clarity, but if by "saved" you mean eternal salvation, then the Jews were definitely not the only ones who could be saved in Old Testament times. God had established covenants with them, but that does not mean they were the only ones who could be saved. God judges by the heart. (1 Sam 16:7) A few other points to note: 1) Altho they didn't go out preaching and seeking converts, the Jews did accept converts. 2) There were Gentiles (non-Jews) in Jesus' lineage (Rahab, Ruth, Bathsheba). 3) God established covenants with mankind even before there was a "Chosen People". With Adam and Eve (promise of seed who would crush the serpent) and with Noah. God's desire has always been the salvation of all mankind and that salvation is open for all. It is each individual's choice. Our Lord God's word to the Jewish prophet Isaiah around 700 years before the New Covenant: Isaiah 49:6 He (God) says: "It is too light a thing that you should be my servant to raise up the tribes of Jacob and to restore the preserved of Israel; I will give you as a light to the nations, that My salvation may reach to the end of the earth." Last edited by Nita; May 27, '10 at 1:57 pm.

#23   May 27, '10, 4:39 pm

PJM Senior Member   Join Date: August 31, 2008 Posts: 8,516 Religion: Informed, practicing RomanCatholic

Re: Why would Jesus say"I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel" in Matthew ? Good post and we agree. THANKS! Pat __________________ PJM http://working4christ2.wordpress.com Can we partake of God's GLORY and NOT partake of His PASSION? NO! A.B. Fulton Sheen: "The truth is the truth even if nobody believes it, and a lie is still a lie, even if everybody believes it."