JharekCarnelian Feb 24, '13, 5:44 am Forum Master JAre Christians the New Jews?

Join Date: January 11, 2007 Location: Israel Posts: 1,949 Religion: Jewish

Are Christians the New Jews? The author of the article: http://www.patheos.com/Jewish/Christ...ein-02-21-2013 an Orthodox Rabbi, posits that today Christians around the world are being persecuted in the same way and for many of the same reasons that Jews have been persecuted throughout the centuries. __________________ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AbIQto3KPUM http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WV6K08RFRQs http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W-C3U...ure=plpp_video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Bf_ZycCZDQ askchosenpeople@gmail.com

#2       Feb 24, '13, 5:44 am

JharekCarnelian  Forum Master   Join Date: April 14, 2008 Location: London, Irish expat Posts: 19,993 Religion: Catholic, Irish, republican - in that order

Re: Are Christians the New Jews? There are plenty of Christians that were perseucuted for these reasons long before the current period of time. We could profitably look at the (sadly almost forgotten) evils visited upon the Armenian Christians. More well known are the persecutions, legal and otherwise, visited upon my own ancestors. Or my wife's homeland and the religious purges and destruction of Churches, imprisonment of clergy and laity and other events there also offer good illustrations of this. What is important about the Copts is that their persecution was ongoing at the time of the historical events I cite but unlike persecution of Irish, Armenian or Orthodox Catholics it is still far more of a current event and far more intensive in scope and type. I subscribe to the view that many peoples are oppressed, have been opressed and will be opressed and that been human any group that is oppressed can just as easily become the opressor, including my own nation. __________________ When Pearse summoned Cuchulain to his side. What stalked through the post Office? What intellect, What calculation, number, measurement, replied?

#3       Feb 24, '13, 7:26 am

Polycarp1  Regular Member   Join Date: September 19, 2007 Posts: 608 Religion: Catholic

Re: Are Christians the New Jews? Christianity is the fulfilment of the Jewish faith and God's covenants with them. Salvation does indeed come from and through the Jewish people. __________________ Tolerance is an attitude of reasoned patience toward evil ... a forbearance that restrains us from showing anger or inflicting punishment. Tolerance applies only to persons ... never to truth. SHEEN

#4       Feb 24, '13, 7:35 am

chosen people  Regular Member   Join Date: January 11, 2007 Location: Israel Posts: 1,949 Religion: Jewish

Re: Are Christians the New Jews? Quote: Originally Posted by Polycarp1  Christianity is the fulfilment of the Jewish faith and God's covenants with them. Salvation does indeed come from and through the Jewish people. The article doesn't refer to Christians as the "New Jews" from a religious belief point of view, but rather from a comparative view of Christians in society and being persecuted today in a way similar to that of Jews. __________________ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AbIQto3KPUM http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WV6K08RFRQs http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W-C3U...ure=plpp_video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Bf_ZycCZDQ askchosenpeople@gmail.com

#5       Feb 24, '13, 8:21 am

Robin des Bois  Trial Membership   Join Date: February 16, 2013 Posts: 69 Religion: Muslim

Re: Are Christians the New Jews? Quote: Originally Posted by chosen people  The author of the article: http://www.patheos.com/Jewish/Christ...ein-02-21-2013 an Orthodox Rabbi, posits that today Christians around the world are being persecuted in the same way and for many of the same reasons that Jews have been persecuted throughout the centuries. It's not true that Israel is the only Mid-Eastern countries where Christians enjoy full freedom and their number is increasing. Lebanon too is witnessing the same thing.

#6       Feb 24, '13, 8:24 am

Robin des Bois  Trial Membership   Join Date: February 16, 2013 Posts: 69 Religion: Muslim

Re: Are Christians the New Jews? Also, Jews are not the only people persecuted throught history for their religion. Shia Muslims too experience the same thing, and are still are.

#7       Feb 24, '13, 8:28 am

Fr P  Trial Membership   Join Date: February 18, 2013 Location: London, UK Posts: 29 Religion: Catholic

Re: Are Christians the New Jews? There are many stories about persecution of Iraqi Christians. I am met quite a few refugees who fled persecution and now campaign for the rights of Iraqi Christians It seems like freedom for the Iraqi people has brought massive persecution for the minority Iraqi Christians.

#8       Feb 24, '13, 12:57 pm

504Katrin  Regular Member   Join Date: March 9, 2011 Location: Germany, but feel more home in New Orleans, La. Posts: 541 Religion: Jewish Revert

Re: Are Christians the New Jews? Did anyone scroll all the way down to the bottom? This Rabbi seems to be fun, and pretty cool: "Yitzchok Adlerstein is an Orthodox rabbi who directs interfaith affairs for the Simon Wiesenthal Center, and chairs Jewish Law at Loyola Law School in Los Angeles. He is hopelessly addicted to the serious study of Torah texts." __________________ And there was a young man named Eutychus sitting on the window sill, sinking into a deep sleep; and as Paul kept on talking, he was overcome by sleep and fell down from the third floor...

#9       Feb 24, '13, 10:16 pm

CopticChristian  Regular Member   Join Date: July 26, 2011 Location: Arizona Posts: 8,158 Religion: Catholic

Re: Are Christians the New Jews? Quote: Originally Posted by chosen people  The author of the article: http://www.patheos.com/Jewish/Christ...ein-02-21-2013 an Orthodox Rabbi, posits that today Christians around the world are being persecuted in the same way and for many of the same reasons that Jews have been persecuted throughout the centuries. Chosen, I don't think so. My experience with Jews and Christians as a culture is radically different insofar as Jews recall their bondage routinely in their lives that would include recollection of the Nazi's and the Passover....seder.....the history of bondage and slavery is very much a part of Judaism and that is not part of the culture of Christianity.... we know we suffer however rather than look at bondage...we believe that we have been liberated from the real bondage, the bondage of sin and Paul tells us we will suffer...the real bondage, the real enslavement was sin, having been freed from sin, we accept that we will suffer in this world...but so what...as Paul says here... Quote: Who will separate us from the love of Christ? Will tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? 36Just as it is written, “FOR YOUR SAKE WE ARE BEING PUT TO DEATH ALL DAY LONG; WE WERE CONSIDERED AS SHEEP TO BE SLAUGHTERED.” 37But in all these things we overwhelmingly conquer through Him who loved us. 38For I am convinced that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers, 39nor height, nor depth, nor any other created thing, will be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord. This is a much different paradigm insofar as we do not wait for liberation as the Jews do...we are liberated....

#10       Feb 26, '13, 8:58 pm

Doxiemom  Junior Member   Join Date: September 18, 2006 Posts: 455 Religion: a loved by God Christian

Re: Are Christians the New Jews? Nope We are the wild branch grafted onto the fig tree. The Jews are still the original branchs of the fig tree. No one replaces the Jews ( and I speak of torah jews,) They are still covered under the Blood covenant between Abraham and God Himself . Just as we, Christians, are the Bride of Christ, The Bridegroom , with Whom we all shall sit down with in the Supper of the Lamb on great day in heaven, the Jewish people are the wife of God. There are many references to this marriage in the old testament. God would not get a divorce. you see, events are not done and God still has a plan for them. Replacement doctrine is a lie.

#11       Yesterday, 8:23 am

CopticChristian  Regular Member   Join Date: July 26, 2011 Location: Arizona Posts: 8,158 Religion: Catholic

Re: Are Christians the New Jews? Quote: Originally Posted by Doxiemom  Nope We are the wild branch grafted onto the fig tree. The Jews are still the original branchs of the fig tree. No one replaces the Jews ( and I speak of torah jews,) They are still covered under the Blood covenant between Abraham and God Himself . Just as we, Christians, are the Bride of Christ, The Bridegroom , with Whom we all shall sit down with in the Supper of the Lamb on great day in heaven, the Jewish people are the wife of God. There are many references to this marriage in the old testament. God would not get a divorce. you see, events are not done and God still has a plan for them. Replacement doctrine is a lie. Doximen, Explain How God has a wife and a bride? Are you suggesting that as I have wrongly heard "God is married to Israel" to support the notion of the dirt we call Israel as the Israel of God? Replacement theology, supersession, a Protestant Doctrine you say is a lie. Praise the Lord...you have discovered your first Protestant lie. There are others.

#12       Yesterday, 1:23 pm

Doxiemom  Junior Member   Join Date: September 18, 2006 Posts: 455 Religion: a loved by God Christian

Re: Are Christians the New Jews? Quote: Originally Posted by CopticChristian  Doximen, Explain How God has a wife and a bride? Are you suggesting that as I have wrongly heard "God is married to Israel" to support the notion of the dirt we call Israel as the Israel of God? Replacement theology, supersession, a Protestant Doctrine you say is a lie. Praise the Lord...you have discovered your first Protestant lie. There are others. it says what it says in the Old testament. God the Father has as His wife the Hebrew people. Jesus-the Son- has Christians as His Bride- He would not lose one of us as we were given to Him by His Father. And yes, the land you call dirt does belongs to the jews. God gave it to them. It doesn't matter if a paticular people or group or world organization doesn't like that idea. A Blood Covenant is forever. God said so. If God lied then, why would we think of another Blood covenant made by Christ at the Last Supper is unbreakable? We never replaced the Jews. But we are so incredibly blessed by God to have been given the opportunity to come to His Son and be saved. There are some jews who have made this decision. Some reject it. Some have not been given enough insight to understand. And some have been blinded to this absolute fact until they scales are come off their eyes and fulfill a purpose set by God. I take it you disagree with me. Fine. We shall ask God one day and find out who is right.

#13       Yesterday, 1:36 pm

CopticChristian  Regular Member   Join Date: July 26, 2011 Location: Arizona Posts: 8,158 Religion: Catholic

Re: Are Christians the New Jews? Quote: Originally Posted by Doxiemom  it says what it says in the Old testament. God the Father has as His wife the Hebrew people. Jesus-the Son- has Christians as His Bride- He would not lose one of us as we were given to Him by His Father. And yes, the land you call dirt does belongs to the jews. God gave it to them. It doesn't matter if a paticular people or group or world organization doesn't like that idea. A Blood Covenant is forever. God said so. If God lied then, why would we think of another Blood covenant made by Christ at the Last Supper is unbreakable? We never replaced the Jews. But we are so incredibly blessed by God to have been given the opportunity to come to His Son and be saved. There are some jews who have made this decision. Some reject it. Some have not been given enough insight to understand. And some have been blinded to this absolute fact until they scales are come off their eyes and fulfill a purpose set by God. I take it you disagree with me. Fine. We shall ask God one day and find out who is right. Doxie, Then we shall wait someday for you to ask God if you are truly saved.

#14       Yesterday, 7:18 pm

Doxiemom  Junior Member   Join Date: September 18, 2006 Posts: 455 Religion: a loved by God Christian

Re: Are Christians the New Jews? Quote: Originally Posted by CopticChristian  Doxie, Then we shall wait someday for you to ask God if you are truly saved. Sweet. Pray tell you are there to hear the answer. Lordy, Lordy, why are some folks just plain mean? Does it please you God ?

#15       Yesterday, 9:06 pm

CopticChristian  Regular Member   Join Date: July 26, 2011 Location: Arizona Posts: 8,158 Religion: Catholic

Re: Are Christians the New Jews? Quote: Originally Posted by Doxiemom  Sweet. Pray tell you are there to hear the answer. Lordy, Lordy, why are some folks just plain mean? Does it please you God ? Doxie, God has a wife that is different than His bride....